On 15 May 2011 at 4:49pm bazm wrote:
Just visited for the first time. I'm very impressed and well done to the trust. Another jewel in the crown for Lewes (castle, Anne of Cleves, bonfire, river Ouse, Southover gardens, Pells, Harveys, railway land...the list goes on and on).
I read on one the notices that the monks brewed their own ale - I wonder if Harveys could reproduce it!
Only sour point was the inevitable dog mess and drink cans left in the ruins.
On 15 May 2011 at 8:26pm padster wrote:
Maybe some of the bonfire societies could celebrate the restoration of the priory
At the next Nov 5th ? Oh hang on a minute that might not work too well.
Every 5th November how dare we forget the slaughter of protestants for their faith by a catholic queen. Fair. I see no recognition that the reason the priory was destroyed was by a king hell bent on destroying catholicism in England and those English who choose to remain loyal to the pope. I think the term is martyrs. We won't talk about that in lewes because its the Catholics that are the bad guys right ? Two sides to every story, killing by both sides in the name of god, you forget that on the 5th.
On 16 May 2011 at 8:13am Mr Happy wrote:
Padster I think you are a bit confused about bonfire if you think that the people who take part in the celebrations are catholic haters. No - one thinks that the catholics are bad guys and probably 50% of the people in the parades are catholic. Stop taking it all so seriously.
On 16 May 2011 at 9:52am Clifford wrote:
padster wrote: 'Two sides to every story, killing by both sides in the name of god, you forget that on the 5th.'
Two sides? Only one as far as I can see. Peace-loving Christians kill one another for their faith in exactly the same way as other religions. Nothing to be proud of really.
On 16 May 2011 at 10:20am 'ere be monsters wrote:
You read into whatever you like Padster, it sounds like you're the one with the biased view.
On 16 May 2011 at 1:39pm Mike wrote:
Agree bazm - another wonderful space - eventually resurrected... & 'great' to see another Lewes thread collapse into pointless political confusion
On 17 May 2011 at 12:32pm Padster wrote:
Sorry, what is being celebrated on the 5th? as you burn effergies of the pope and mock catholic mass??????? the bishops at cliffe. 50% Hhmm I dont think so but who's counting, most there dont even get the religious undertones.
I still maintain lets not forget why the priory was sacked, and you know what Mike, this is a forum for people to express their views, if it's a bit political for you or a bit pointless, and you find it too confusing, there is a really great program on channel 5 called "HELLO TV" you might enjoy that more.
On 17 May 2011 at 1:17pm Paul Newman wrote:
Yes Padster, there are two sides to the story.Here is one side . The Pope backed continued plots by absolutist continental powers to install puppet governments , the terrorist atrocity aimed at destroying soul of a free Nation its parliament. The papacy sponsored various attempts to assassinate our Queen not to say industrial scale genocide cross Europe during the counter reformation.
Religion and politics are inextricable throughout the period .Bonfire celebrates freedom from foreign tyranny absolutist monarchs and intellectual "authority" which opposed enlightenment leading the flowering of this Nation above all ,as a place of freedom
Whats your side ? Better be good .
On 17 May 2011 at 1:18pm Hedley Lamarr wrote:
Oh come on Padser. Your sentiments are not really political and, if I may say so, they are rather offensive. This happened 500 years ago for goodness sake. I doubt if there is one person out of the 40,000 attendees on the 5th who think the revelries are anything but a bit of fun. Where are the anti Catholic sentiments in the other 364 days of the year? There aren‚??t any!
The lack of ability to draw a line under old (and I mean old) injustices has been the cause of conflict throughout history. Do I get irate at 1066? No - it happened and we lived with it. Thankfully some people are blessed with this ability.
On 17 May 2011 at 1:23pm Paul Newman wrote:
The historical antipathy to Catholicism in this country has nothing to do with modern sectarianism but I don`t think we need to ditch history as it happened or overly sanitise its commemoration.
So some feather get ruffled.
Remembering is important.
On 17 May 2011 at 1:55pm Hedley Lamarr wrote:
PN: Who said we should ditch history? I didn't. Who said we should sanitise history? I didn't. Remember by all means but don't bear grudges! And never apologise for something our forebears did 1000 years ago!
On 17 May 2011 at 2:28pm Windymiller wrote:
Calm down children, enjoy the priory, it's lovely.
On 17 May 2011 at 2:47pm Hedley Lamarr wrote:
So it is. I lost the thread of this post!
On 17 May 2011 at 3:22pm Clifford wrote:
Paul Newman wrote: 'The Pope backed continued plots by absolutist continental powers to install puppet governments , the terrorist atrocity aimed at destroying soul of a free Nation its parliament.'
Such a 'free nation' that we had to have a civil war 35 years later against the 'divine right of kings'.
On 17 May 2011 at 3:58pm Paul Newman wrote:
.. which enlightended Nation are you comparing us with in such dispraging terms Clifford? France German Spain? Do tell.....
Actually ,on topic ,I was rather underwhelmed by the place when we went along . Hard to put your finger on but I somehow didn`t get much sense of the lives it once contained.
On 17 May 2011 at 6:37pm Clifford wrote:
You'll really have to go back to school to learn how to argue Paul. I pointed out that this country was hardly 'a free nation' in 1605 and that there had to be a civil war (some people call it a 'revolution') 35 years later to combat 'the divine right of kings'. Instead of engaging that and perhaps trying to persuade us that we were indeed 'a free nation' in 1605 you throw in irrelevancies about France, Germany and Spain. What do you think the civil war was about? Do tell...
On 17 May 2011 at 7:37pm Mike wrote:
hahahha - Windymiller - Hedley Lamarr - well said.. BTW, don't watch telly - these threads are far too entertaining...
On 17 May 2011 at 11:05pm Paul Newman wrote:
The divine right of a Scottish king who misunderstood his role even then but why stop there Clifford ? Universal Suffrage finally arrived in 1928 . You are making anachronistic judgements vastly less illuminating that comparing realities at the time and afterwards elsewhere.What do you want , a modern Liberal democracy ?
On 17 May 2011 at 11:06pm Paul Newman wrote:
Only in England , at that time was it obvious that to paralyse the state it was necessary not only to murder the King but Parliament as well. The subsequent growth of the power of Parliament and the development of Constitutional Monarchy is intimately bound up with safeguarding Protestantism against Catholic succession . Bonfire celebrations were, from the start democratic street corner affairs asserting independence and the individualist spirit that have characterised this Island. So there ....
On 20 May 2011 at 5:22pm padster wrote:
So you cant be free and catholic? OOh the nasty catholic pope coming to take away your freedoms and parliament ...oooh scary....boo mr pope booo.
break it down , never mind luther, Big boy henry 8 wanted to bag another chick , pope said no way cant be done so big boy henry 8 said screw you popey, come on england lets do it my way , now where the women at......
Is basically what happened,
I know I know i am very learned....