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waterloo bottle it again

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On 6 Nov 2014 at 8:58am Old timer wrote:
Looks like Waterloo bottled it again last nite
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 9:06am Landporter wrote:
They had no choice, if they took their effigy out, they would've risked more criminal accusations. Commercial square were the same so stop blaming waterloo for everything.
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 9:34am old timer wrote:
if waterloo had taken their effigy out on their walk to the fire like cliffe do instead of trying to do oneupmanship on the rest this situation would not have arose so yes waterloo are to blame ,no strength in their beliefs. CARNIVAL
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 9:55am Landporter wrote:
Time to be sticking together, not having a cheap dig at other societies, old timer. Stuff like this will see the end of Lewes bonfire if you don't all pull in the same direction. Cut the elitist Cliffe crap and sort it together as one voice.
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 10:01am old timer wrote:
landporter im not a cliffe member just pointing out the elitest attitude of waterloo why would you reveal your tab to the press unless you want to score points.i agree this will see the end of lewes bonfire,in my 72 years i have never been so concerned for it and we have seen some pretty bad times
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 10:13am Landporter wrote:
They didn't reveal it to the press, they got it out from it's "shed" and the press were waiting. Sky news have been hanging around all week to get an exclusive "first" so im sure there have been others. Anyway, im pretty sure it was ESCC who took the photo and put it on twitter before it went viral. ESCC later withdrew the photo but it was too late.
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 10:53am bobajob wrote:
The perceived "torry" insult by ESCC posting the photo was the only reason the anger took off the way it did... maybe a lesson to keep the tarps on until you actually process it.
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 10:57am bobajob wrote:
And perhaps a reminder the secrecy is not just for tradition to keep it a surprise for the town / rivalry
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 11:25am my town wrote:
That's it now. W l b s.and c s b s have gone down now to roll over like that
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 12:18pm CBS wrote:
From what I understand, CSBS did fire their Tableau, and I will reserve judgment on Waterloo until I know all the facts. I suspect there might be a few more Scottish themed Tabs next year though.
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 1:47pm one of them wrote:
It's my understanding that Waterloo received some very serious threats against members of the society and so theeffigy was pulled for their safety. It was not a case of 'bottling' it
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 2:15pm bastian wrote:
Unfortunately the scum bag in the county council who photographed it and twittered it is to blame for causing the wider world to inspect what our traditions are with the critical eye of an easily offended outsider. As to Salmonds comments about Sussex Tories then he is a fool to think everyone here is politically minded to the right, if at all.
The day we are censored for what we do is the day bonfire dies. We must not let this happen. If the wider world saw all the amazing tableauxs built by all the societies for the last twenty years, including the building and the weeks of effort put in for free they should be amazed, rather than offended. If we just let this rest there will be more of it next year until we don't have a subject left worth creating for FEAR of incrimination. Who wants to live in fear?
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 3:40pm belladonna wrote:
reposting this - as it seems to have been deleted
I'm a Scot. I live in Lewes. I supported independence. I'm a member of CSBS. I'm not offended.
Get a grip Scots Nats. It's not racist. Stop being silly and reactionary and read up about the history and cultural traditions of the town before you jump to conclusions.
I'm not sure why Alex Salmond was chosen cos to me he's a bit of minor player now and hardly an enemy of the people, but I suspect its more to do with the notion that his campaign for independence nearly broke up the union. So although Waterloo said otherwise, it is political.
Vladimir Putin was also blown up - is that racist as well ? What about Obama, Cameron, Merkel, Blair, Assad, - well the list is long, but Salmond finds himself at the top table of effigies - and in good or dubious company (whatever your political perspective).

Read up about Lewes bonfire and find the true history of the town and its cultural tradition. You might find you quite like this small haven of radicalism and liberalism and free speech in a sea of Tories. (Funny how the Scots Nats used to be known as the Tartan Tories - forgotten that ? And how Salmond enabled that awful idiot American businessman Donald Trump) to intimidate locals and build a golf course on a unique stretch of beautiful coastline??)
To me bonfire is all about remembering and protecting freedom of speech, thought, religion and the principles of democracy itself. Bonfire is about the people of the town reclaiming the streets for themselves.
I bet Alex Salmond will love the attention. It's a bit like all those satirical Spitting Image puppets that the politicians featured all wanted to buy.
By the way - is burning a Viking long boat at Up Helly Aa in the Shetlands racist to Norwegians ? or that fact that only men march, sexist ?
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 3:47pm Adrian wrote:
Does anyone know where Waterloo's effigy of Alex Salmond is now? If so, please email adrian.imms@theargus.co.uk or call 01273 544518 in confidence.
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 4:31pm Claire Duc wrote:
Well said Belladonna!
 
 
On 6 Nov 2014 at 5:08pm olithedrifter wrote:
@MWstory Ill-informed attention seeker.
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 7:43pm Shardlake wrote:
Complete over-reaction by ill-informed individuals jumping on the bandwagon of 'being easily offended'. Get a grip. Bonfire Societies need to stick together otherwise Bonfire itself will be under threat. Whatever happened to a sense of humour?
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 8:53pm biker wrote:
they blew it up at 5 o clock this afternoon
 
 
On 6 Nov 2014 at 9:25pm Skid marks wrote:
It's sitting in the bar up the lamb Adrian.
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 10:14pm Daydreamer wrote:
Typical Argus reporter - Can't you get the information yourselves ! I do worry the day that there will be no forum for you to get your stories from !!!
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 10:14pm Daydreamer wrote:
Typical Argus reporter - Can't you get the information yourselves ! I do worry the day that there will be no forum for you to get your stories from !!!
 
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 11:02pm Donna wrote:
While I understand the tradition of the bonfire it was offensive and racist.
As it was too near the vote not the right time or the right subject and I wonder if in Scotland we burnt Saint George as bonfire fun.
How quickly it would be picked up on and stopped, maybe we should try it.
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 11:03pm NF wrote:
So if waterloo members received threats these were presumably reported to the police?
Adrian: shove it up your arse journo-scum
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On 6 Nov 2014 at 11:58pm aargh! wrote:
Donna there have been enough explanations on the internet now for everyone on the planet to understand. If you still don't get it there's nothing more to say to you. You appear to be comparing Alex Salmond to St George. I'm sure he would be flattered. I'm sure worse things than an effigy of St George have been burned on town bonfires over the years.
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On 7 Nov 2014 at 8:23am bastian wrote:
that's the point, we, the people of Lewes don't care if you burn st George or any other figure, because we respect your right and freedom to do so. That's what makes Lewes tick-freedom.
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On 7 Nov 2014 at 10:02am Penguin wrote:
The point that everyone is missing so spectacularly is that tableaux are not effigies. They are a three dimensional representation of particular current events (or as current as is possible given the time required to build it!). They are usually humorous - but I suppose to appreciate that you need to have a sense of humour! They often portray political figures as the big news is usually political and the characters involved are usually recognisable, however they don’t always portray people at all.
Phrases like 'burnt in effigy' and the connotations that go with that create a completely wrong impression. Tableaux are not burnt, they are a feature of a firework display, and whilst they may be controversial, they are no more offensive than the political cartoons that can be found every day in the newspapers, but I don't remember any accusations of racism being directed at the national press.
So, Salmond featured this year. It doesn't mean anyone hates him, or hates Scotland, or the Loch Ness monster come to that. It was just a topical story. As for being racist, well I have never heard anything so stupid in my life, and for pictures of the Salmond tableau to be circulated on the internet next to pictures of Ku Klux Klan members is just total ignorance.
I keep hearing people justify their over-reaction by saying that we wouldn't build a tableau of St. George – well here’s some news for you, Cliffe Bonfire Society have done exactly that in the past. I don't know the history of other societies but subjects have also included members of the royal family, the town of Lewes itself, not to mention the Societies own emblem. I am sure the other societies have done similar things, but I have certainly never heard any accusations of Bonfire/Lewes being anti-English, anti-Royal, anti-Lewes, or anti-their own members, because up to now everyone has understood what the tableaux actually are, the spirit in which they are made, and the part they play in our celebrations.
It is a pity that the easily offended don't do a little bit of research about the history and traditions of Bonfire before clamouring up onto their imagined moral high ground and making rash and un-educated accusations. I am assuming that these same people do not get so offended about burning Guy Fawkes, after all this is done in towns all over the country. Guy Fawkes was English, he was white, he was a Catholic, he was from Yorkshire, so there is plenty of scope there for almost the entire population to get offended! Thing is, most of the population are intelligent enough to understand!
 
 
On 7 Nov 2014 at 10:07am Musher wrote:
Donna, go for it! There's nothing like a bit of grass roots mischief for bringing a community together and it would be a brilliant response to our blowing up of your beloved Alex. I reckon a tableau of a bonfire boy in a stripy jumper would probably be easier than St George as he'll just look like a crusader unless you include a dragon etc. You'd get nothing but smiles from this bonfire boy.
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On 7 Nov 2014 at 10:21am Peter wrote:
Well said Penguin. And remember that CSBS had Lord Nelson a few years ago.
Why didn't Waterloo cover the tableau with a tarp until the procession?
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On 9 Nov 2014 at 9:01am Waterloo tableaux wrote:
Waterloo had a tableau with 2 smugglers (one looking very much like their chairman) a couple of years ago. But it was a tableau, not an effigy (see above).
Until now, it has never been needed to cover tableaux. They have always been pulled through the town from where they are made to County Hall ready for the night uncovered. But until now, no person in County Hall has tweeted a picture of them.
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On 10 Nov 2014 at 3:07pm Penguin wrote:
@Donna - Can you please just explain in what way the tableau was either offensive or racist? Simple question. It's easy to make such accusations to wind everyone up, but now please justify it. I really hope you can enlighten me (and many others), as I have seen plenty of pictures of it now, and I just can't see how you can describe it in that way. What is it that you see that we don't?


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