On 19 May 2016 at 8:49pm EU MYTH BUSTER wrote:
Myth: The trade deal the EU is signing with the US will lead to privatisation of the NHSInFact: TTIP would not mean the privatisation of UK healthcare – and any agreement we strike post-Brexit could be worse. On this issue, as in others, we can better stand up for British interests as members of a larger bloc.More information
The trade deal the EU is negotiating with the US is under scrutiny for its impact on the National Health Service (NHS). The transatlantic trade and investment partnership (TTIP) puts the NHS in “severe danger”, David Owen told the Guardian.
He is not the only one to worry. Legal advice commissioned by the Unite trade union assessed that TTIP posed a real and serious risk to UK decision-making on the NHS. These concerns also seem to be shared by Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn and the Labour Leave campaign group.
One major worry is that the deal might mean NHS services have to open up to private competition. American companies, according to this line of thought, might take us to court under the arbitration mechanism TTIP sets up, and in effect force privatisation. Others fret that TTIP might lead to a change in NHS drug pricing policy – since US pharmaceutical companies often argue that the NHS sets prices too low.
These fears are overstated. Ensuring competition in public procurement does not mean putting public services in jeopardy. The EU has tough rules in this area but, after 40 years of UK membership of the bloc, the NHS sails on.
TTIP negotiators have been clear that the pact would not prevent governments from providing health services. In a joint statement, EU Trade Commissioner Cecilia Malmstrom and US Trade Representative Mike Froman said “no EU or US trade agreement requires governments to privatise any service” – nor prevents them renationalising those already privatised.
Owen is clearly not convinced by their assurances. But others are. TTIP “will certainly not mean the privatisation of the NHS”, wrote Boris Johnson last October.
Separately, Johnson has cited the ability to clinch an independent trade deal with the United States as an advantage of Brexit, as has Nigel Farage, supporting the rival Grassroots Out campaign.
For them, the question is not whether we should have an agreement with the United States. Rather, Brexiteers argue we could strike a better bargain if we make that deal on our own account, rather than as an EU member. After all, we would be free to push our own interests instead of having to reconcile them with the priorities of 27 other EU nations.
But this logic assumes the US would give us what we asked for in negotiations. However, the UK economy is less than one-sixth of America’s size, whereas the EU as a bloc is bigger than the United States.
It also assumes that other Europeans’ concerns do not coincide with our own. This is not so. Even if other Europeans do not all follow the NHS model, they still have public healthcare and other public services that they will be keen to shield from American corporations. Other EU nations will also presumably not be eager to see NHS drug prices change, since they often use those prices as a reference. And nor are we the only ones concerned over TTIP arbitration mechanisms – a backlash led by Germany has already caused those provisions to be watered down.
In defending public healthcare, as in many other issues, we can better stand up for British interests as members of a larger bloc. As four ex-health secretaries and nearly 200 health professionals and researchers have argued, we are healthier in the EU.
On 19 May 2016 at 9:44pm Clifford wrote:
Isn't a misuse of the Forum simply to cut-and-paste propaganda? I assume it's Paul Newman up to his tricks again.
This is where it comes from:
Check it out here »
On 19 May 2016 at 10:58pm Myth Buster. wrote:
Is n` t Clifford just a cut and paste armchair Anarchist?A cardboard anti establishment clown and a friend of fascism?
On 20 May 2016 at 1:22am Sussex Rim wrote:
Well of course he's a friend of the Fascists, all left wingers are. The Nazis were left wingers of course, Paul Newman said so. Except the Daily Mail supported Hitler. Is the Daily Mail a socialist paper?
You know what we should do, we should keep an eye out for Daily Mail readers and beat them up, stinking filthy pinkoes. They couldn't complain because we'd only be doing what the socialist Nazis did to the Jews, and the commie rag they read supported the Nazis.
On 20 May 2016 at 6:21am pn wrote:
Not me Clifford I roll my own, all fair comment though , this sort of myth has been put about by precisely the people who would like to see the end of the NHS
PS Stop obsessing about me its creepy and wierd
On 20 May 2016 at 8:08am It is weird wrote:
@pn it is weird how some people obsess about you and your opinions here I agree . Your posts are long and rambly but that's fine , your stalker/groupie/secret fan/ creepy weirdo obsessers love them really I think . Maybe they feel close to you while they're reading them , Maybe they're jealous ? . Btw it's funny how they are always right and you're always wrong , they must be so clever .
On 20 May 2016 at 9:10am Mark wrote:
Well actually the TTIP deal that Obama has pushed for (and that Cameron has enthusiastically supported) would make it quite impossible for the NHS to continue but I suspect that the German/French influence will protect us from that. I've no objection to free trade deals but TTIP is not a simple free trade deal. It's a complex set of supranational political regulations dreamt up on Wall St - a wolf in sheep's clothing. It puts me in mind of how the Americans spot clever BBC sitcoms and remake them for their own market. I think that they noticed the EU and its suprapolitical powers, its lack of accountability. And thought, "Well that's an idea! We could really crack on with that. We could be running all European public services in no time at all."
On 21 May 2016 at 10:40pm Time to get a life wrote:
Yet another thread started by this bloke using yet another name. Mate, can you please desist? You are making this forum very, very dull. It's becoming a hobby horse for you, and no one else. If you keep starting these EU and Corbyn threads with the frequency you are no one else gets a lookin and this forum starts to look like it's got your agenda. The quickest way to disinterest and closure.
Now please desist. Go to the pub, meet some people but please, give this forum a rest!
On 22 May 2016 at 6:30pm Time to get a wife wrote:
Yet another thread started by this bloke using yet another name. Mate, can you please desist? You are making this forum very, very dull. It's becoming a hobby horse for you, and no one else. If you keep starting these threads in which you disparage threads and posters in which you have no interest with the frequency you are, no one else gets a look in and this forum starts to look like it's got your agenda. The quickest way to disinterest and closure.Now please desist. Go to the pub, meet some people,have a political discussion,read a non tabloid newspaper,get a girlfriend or a boyfriend forget about your pigeon loft and your gerbil, and please, give this forum a rest!