On 10 Apr 2014 at 8:42pm Local Bod wrote:
I am wondering if anyone succeeded in finding out how residents can qualify for an HS Zone Parking permit, if they don't live in Zone HS? I want to know if I can apply as it is time to renew.
On 10 Apr 2014 at 8:50pm The Old Mayor wrote:
Don't you have to be a window cleaner, health visitor, contractor or someone who has to park inorder to carry out their business in that area ?
On 11 Apr 2014 at 12:21pm Merlin Milner wrote:
Correspondence from ESCC.
"As mentioned in my previous response I can confirm that no HS permits have been issued to residents who do not qualify for them. The qualifying criteria is an address within the HS area shown on the permit eligibility map, along with the necessary documents required when applying for a permit."
On 11 Apr 2014 at 1:42pm Local Bod wrote:
Sorry to drag this out but I had already looked at the HS Zone permit eligibility area map but it does not match the actual HS Zone. They are different. Merlin, could you find out why this is? This is the whole point. Some residents clearly do not live in the HS Zone, so should not qualify for an HS permit, but for reasons unknown are being described as 'eligible' on a "permit eligibility map" and getting an HS Permit but without ESCC explaining to any of us what makes them eligible. That is what I want ESCC to explain to you, so I can find out if I am also eligible. Do we know who is supplying this strange information? Is it the Parking Shop or someone at ESCC?
On 11 Apr 2014 at 2:22pm Merlin Milner wrote:
The person that I have been in contact with is David Weeks at ESCC.
On 11 Apr 2014 at 2:25pm Taxpayer wrote:
I checked the ESCC website and there are definitely discrepancies between the HS Zone map, and the eligibility Map. The most obvious is I think a bit of Bull Lane. The website also makes it clear you need proof of address that you live in a Zone, to get a permit. So is the eligibility map correct? How can residents in Bull Lane provide proof of address for HS zone, when they don't live in it ,as proved by the HS Zone map? How are they eligible?
On 11 Apr 2014 at 2:33pm Parker Knowles wrote:
"no HS permits have been issued to residents who do not qualify for them"
so he didn't answer the question then, which presumably was "how do they qualify when they are not a resident in HS Zone"
He simply said, they do qualify, but I am not going to tell you how.
On 11 Apr 2014 at 3:52pm Baffled wrote:
Eh? How can a scheme work if permits for a zone are handed out to 'eligible' people not living in the zone? i thought only zone residents getting permits was the whole point of the wretched thing.
On 11 Apr 2014 at 4:35pm Merlin Milner wrote:
I have emailed ESCC again. Others can do likewise.
On 11 Apr 2014 at 5:06pm Annette Curtin-Twitcher wrote:
It would appear that someone, somewhere, has decided that the eligibility zone should be different from the zone itself in the case of the HS zone.
I think the question that needs asking is why, and how, this decision was made. If it is so that people just outside the zone area are being permitted to park within it, why isn't this principle being extended to people who live near the boundaries of other zones?
It must be very annoying if you're on the edge of a zone and you have to park half a mile away because nearby spaces in your zone are full, but there are free spaces in the adjacent zone which are much nearer. I've said from the start of this stupid scheme that people who live near zone boundaries should be allocated permits that are valid for both zones.
On 11 Apr 2014 at 6:45pm Mr Angry wrote:
Infuriating ain't it !
On 11 Apr 2014 at 8:59pm Lewes Resident wrote:
So now we have proof that secret permits are being issued to some people shown as being eligible for a zone they clearly are not actually in. So how do those of us without these secret permits get included on an eligibility map?
Thank you Merlin for persisting. I think we can all now see why ESCC are so reluctant to give you the whole truth.
On 12 Apr 2014 at 7:21am Parker Knowles wrote:
From the Council's own advice, in the section "How Does A Resident's Permit Work ?"
"A permit will only be issued if you are:
a permanent resident at an address in the relevant permit zone within the CPZ"
Are the Council now saying that they have changed the scheme completely and now a permit will only be issued if you are a permanent resident at an address in the "eligibility for a relevant permit zone". Is this a whole new secret policy?
As ACT correctly points out, if this was the case, why isn't this principal being extended to everyone else? Aren't the Council legally obliged to stick with the Zones they created? Zone boundaries which identify which Zone parking spaces and residences are in, are defined by a legal process.
The most obvious explanation for this discrepancy that the Council are so reluctant to explain is that the 'eligibility map' is just inaccurate. It is certainly misleading because it is clear from the evidence that some residences shown are not eligible at all.
On 12 Apr 2014 at 9:12am Tipex wrote:
Sounds like an error on the eligibility map. NOT a conspiracy.
On 12 Apr 2014 at 10:17am Annette Curtin-Twitcher wrote:
Generally, I'm inclined to believe it cock-up rather than conspiracy when it comes to local government, but in this case, I'm not so sure.
Maybe they found the take-up for HS permits was lower than expected, so decided to widen the eligibility zone.
On 13 Apr 2014 at 9:46am Claire wrote:
I agree there's way too much council bashing around here. Generally they do a good job on a minimal budget.
On 13 Apr 2014 at 11:47pm Annoyed wrote:
If there is no conspiracy , why are the people who live in the areas shown on the eligibility map, but not on the actual zone map secretly getting permits that don't meet with the parking scheme policy?
On 14 Apr 2014 at 9:11am HS Resident wrote:
or a conspiracy that started with a cock-up…..The answers Merlin and John Stockdale have been given are clear examples of Council officers being ambiguous about why the fundamental policy that a resident must live in a zone to be eligible for a permit in it, is being breached. How long has the Council known this? Ask yourself why other CPZ's don't have 'permit eligibility area' maps?
On 14 Apr 2014 at 10:14am Earl of De Montfort wrote:
HS? High Street? We have a map that clearly shows all parking zones
On 14 Apr 2014 at 10:43am Another HS Resident wrote:
If you read the whole thread you will see that Merlin has identified that there are two inconsistent maps. One shows the HS Zone and the other, very mysterious map, shows what is being called a 'permit eligibility area' It shows a different area from the HS Zone. The reason this is very odd, and so far unexplained, is that Policy, and the whole basis of a Parking scheme, is that one has to be a resident in a zone to be eligible for it. We are all all trying to find out why the Council is creating secret policy breaching 'eligibility' without telling us how we can be eligible. Merlin is going to find out for us.
On 16 Apr 2014 at 12:22pm Merlin Milner wrote:
Response from ESCC.
"As a general rule resident permits are only available to addresses within a zone. To enable us to assist residents permit eligibility does not form part of our traffic regulation orders. This gives us the flexibility to respond to specific parking problems and assist in locations with exceptional needs.
There are two differences in the boundary of zone HS and the addresses eligible for a permit. These are locations that have been identified as having very limited parking and permit eligibility has been amended to assist residents. The two differences in zone HS are:
•North Street (between West Street and Little East Street) where there are no parking bays, and
•Bull Lane where there is only one parking bay.
On 16 Apr 2014 at 6:48pm Annette Curtin-Twitcher wrote:
That doesn't quite answer the question, imo.
If the policy is that permit eligibility is dependent on people living within the zone in question, then officers have no business in overturning policy.
If the drawing up of eligible areas is a matter delegated to officers, then I suggest that all those who live near zone boundaries and find it easier to park in adjacent zones ask for their streets to be considered permits in adjoining areas.
On 18 Apr 2014 at 3:38pm Local Bod wrote:
ACT you are exactly right. See my post in new thread. Something smells rotten here….
On 18 Apr 2014 at 5:38pm Eh? wrote:
what about consultation? when were these two areas identified, and who was told about it ? what exactly are these permits that are being issued? they can't be HS permits because these areas aren't in HS and the boundary hasn't been changed. do these permits have a special name? Looks like ESCC have been well and truly caught out making it up as they go along!