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Is making poor health choices a Human Right?

On 10 May 2011 at 1:02pm Clio wrote:
It‚??s a Headstrong Club meeting on Friday evening.
New members are welcome - Attendance is free for your first visit.
This month‚??s topic: ‚??Is Public Health a Private Matter?‚?Ě
What role does the government have in shaping Public Health outcomes? Is the freedom to kill yourself through poor diet or smoking the ultimate expression of your human rights?
Our speaker is Steven Bevan, Managing Director of the Work Foundation.
Do join us upstairs at the Royal Oak from 8pm for an evening of lively discussion.
On 10 May 2011 at 1:53pm Donna Edmunds wrote:
Sadly am off to Bath for the weekend. When's the next one?
On 10 May 2011 at 3:27pm Clio wrote:
Hi Donna
The next one is on the 17th June, in a different venue this time: upstairs at the Elephant and Castle.
The speaker will be Baroness Janet Whitaker, the topic is "The Plight of Travellers in the UK".
I'll post about this again, nearer the time. Hope to see you there.
On 10 May 2011 at 4:09pm Paul Newman wrote:
I haven't been for a while( Do you mean the blight of travellers....... ?)
On 10 May 2011 at 7:16pm Clio wrote:
Paul: No, definitely meant "Plight". Would be lovely to see you at meeting soon, especially if you have strong opinions which you can express eloquently. Good luck with that, and see you soon!
On 10 May 2011 at 8:09pm Steve McQueen wrote:
Go along Paul. Maybe you'll make more sense when you don't have to type.
On 10 May 2011 at 10:33pm Donna Edmunds wrote:
See you there, Paul (and Clio)
On 11 May 2011 at 6:18am Clio wrote:
Wonderful! After the July meeting there's a short break over the summer and we'll resume later in the year.
At the moment we don't have a website but I'm currently working on putting one together. I'll post on here with updates or follow @headstrongclub on Twitter.
On 11 May 2011 at 9:15am John Stockdale wrote:
Janet Whitaker is an expert on traveller matters and is a kind of spokesman on these issues in the House of Lords. She's extremely well informed about this difficult subject. I'll be try to get there.
On 11 May 2011 at 11:54am Clio wrote:
John: Thanks for your comment. Hope to see you there.
On 12 May 2011 at 9:12am Brixtonbelle wrote:
the answer is both yes and no. it's not an aboslute right to be enshrined in law, but you have the personal right to abuse your own body with bad food, drugs (any sort), no exercise etc. No one can force you into eating fresh veg, exercising, or stop you working long hours. (Unless you live in a state dictatorship like China of course)
On 12 May 2011 at 10:14am Paul Newman wrote:
Is that Mayor Stockdale now then ?

BB - Do you think there is really any such thing as a 'human right' in a universal sense at all ? We enshrine the right of women to pay more for motor Insurance and Criminals to influence laws they have not previously shown any regard for. God knows why ?
I am not sure you have rights merely by dint of being human. I think they only exist in a culture enmeshed with duties.Its like a club ,you pay your dues ,obey the rules and you acquire rights. Otherwise you don`t.
On 12 May 2011 at 10:26am A Human wrote:
"I am not sure you have rights merely by dint of being human. I think they only exist in a culture enmeshed with duties.Its like a club ,you pay your dues ,obey the rules and you acquire rights. Otherwise you don`t."
Idiot! That's exactly how totalitarian regimes justify their existence. You really are a prize nob-end.
On 12 May 2011 at 11:30am MC wrote:
Our society needs to place a much stronger emphasis on responsibility and individual responsibilities. Concentration has been placed on rights for far too long and a result has been a fostering an immature me-me, i-know-my-rights attitude.
On 12 May 2011 at 11:41am Paul Newman wrote:
Human- Are you saying this country was a Totalitarian regime prior to the Human Rights Act being incorporated into our law ?I hadn`t noticed .....
On 12 May 2011 at 11:57am Clio wrote:
What a lovely discussion. I only hope we can move it into the realm of Real Life, perhaps in a pub setting. See you there!
On 12 May 2011 at 1:57pm MC wrote:
A discussion with Mr Paul Newman, with alcohol? Not certain that's a good idea.

I will look out for you Clio. What do you look like?
On 12 May 2011 at 2:04pm Grunge wrote:
Webbo, once again my post hasn't appeared. Any idea why?
On 12 May 2011 at 2:08pm A Human wrote:
@Butch Cassidy
You have a remarkable talent for putting words into other people's mouths, attacking those words and then claiming victory.
I was addressing your idiotic contention that basic human rights need to be earned.
On 12 May 2011 at 2:09pm Grunge wrote:
And this previous post has. Why not the once I wrote before, in which I said that Paul and MC are right. Rights go with responsibilities. That may be painful news to some.
Prisoners, for example, regard it as their "human right" to vote. However, the fact that they are in prison means that they have deprived someone else of their human rights. Therefore, apart from what is necessary to keep them well and alive, their own privileges (or rights) should be curtailed until they have finished their sentence. Therefore, no vote; they don't deserve it.
On 12 May 2011 at 2:32pm MC wrote:
I have the same problem Grunge. I always copy my post onto my clipboard now before posting in case they don't 'take'.

BTW. If you use stars or pointy brackets in posts (as I often do) then I think the forum automatically bans you.
On 12 May 2011 at 2:37pm DFLoater wrote:
"I am not sure you have rights merely by dint of being human. I think they only exist in a culture enmeshed with duties.Its like a club ,you pay your dues ,obey the rules and you acquire rights. Otherwise you don`t."
Utter nonsense, as usual. Where do the insane, the mentally retarded or even animals stand in your world-view?
Do teachers have the right to expect their contracts to be honoured, even if they have honestly and diligently fulfilled their 'duties'?
Rights aren't awarded - they're taken away.
On 12 May 2011 at 4:11pm Clifford wrote:
'We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just Powers from the consent of the governed, ‚?? That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.'
Much more eloquent than any of the usual Tory twaddle that appears here.
On 12 May 2011 at 4:47pm Paul Newman wrote:
Ok what about the right to life ? As we know a good proportion of the world lives on the edge of starvation or dies of it, or dies early of preventable diseases. In our own country there are parts of Glasgow where male life expectancy is in the mid 50s.
If all these people have a right to life who took it away ? Who owes them ?
Many more people live as wage slaves barely discernable from slavery around the world , who owes them Liberty , who took it away? This is a nonsensical; question.
I cannot see any relevance to the concept of "Rights ". If we are saying in some vague way that people should be nice to eachother then we do not require that concept. We did not require it in this country and it seems to me to have done considerable harm.
On the subject of the mentally ill .I feel they are as valuable as anyone else . How do you feel about the unborn child ? Does he have rights ?

On 12 May 2011 at 10:26pm Clio wrote:
MC: i shall be wearing glasses and a brown and white striped shirt. I should imagine I will be one of the younger members of the crowd. Relatively, at least
On 12 May 2011 at 10:59pm Mrs Twine wrote:
I shall be wearing my usual teacosy.
On 13 May 2011 at 11:24am brixtonbelle wrote:
Isn't that a little threadbare Mrs Twine ? Could cause a riot amongst the string vendors...
On 13 May 2011 at 1:07pm Mrs Twine wrote:
Modesty will be preserved, BB. I can cover all my wherewithalls with some of my trusty lentils.

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