On 6 Sep 2018 at 11:26am bored wrote:
Final report coming soon. Does it matter if we swap Newhaven and Seaford for Polegate and Uckfield?
If we're making changes to parliament that are billed as making things more equal should we consider proportional representation too?
Lots of anger seems to come from people feeling ignored or not represented by parliament and government. PR could help address that I feel. Thoughts?
On 6 Sep 2018 at 11:54am Norman wrote:
If the majority in my area vote for candidate A then shouldn't they be elected?
On 6 Sep 2018 at 12:18pm Buzzard wrote:
Norman - yes. if a candidate gets a majority they shoudl be elected.But suppose 40% vote for candidate A and 30% each for candidates B & C, who have quite similar policies to each other and strongly oppose A, That's 60% against A, but s/he gets elected because the opposition is split. And it may be that B voters would rather have C than A, and C voters rather B than A, but those preferences are ignored.
On 6 Sep 2018 at 2:06pm Clifford wrote:
With PR you tend to get a government nobody voted for, a coalition cobbled together after the election, often with small parties being able to force the pace.
On 6 Sep 2018 at 2:32pm Gianfranco wrote:
How has strange voting habits worked in Italy? You just get more changes of government and little or no progress.
On 6 Sep 2018 at 2:57pm bored wrote:
@Norman, yes, that would makes sense. PR includes variations that do this. If an MP gets the majority of votes in a constituency then their party will almost certainly have at least one MP and by ranking votes per candidate that for their party nationwide that candidate will almost certainly be an MP.
In 2015 UKIP had almost 4 million votes, 12.6% of the country voted for them. Yet they had 1 MP. I would say it's less unfair to risk what you say may happen. Greens more than 1 million votes and one MP too. The parliament didn't represent the country.
Clifford, not sure exactly what you mean? People will of course have voted for only one party. It is impossible to vote for a coalition.
It's a bit of a fallacy that small parties control everything in a coalition. We have our the recent Lib Dem example. They had to give up most of their manifesto.
DUP main goals don't seem to be doing too well either.
On 6 Sep 2018 at 3:00pm Robert wrote:
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On 6 Sep 2018 at 6:00pm Clifford wrote:
Bored, Yes I agree with you about the Tory/LibDem coalition. But look at Israel, where tiny extreme parties always steer the inevitable coalition. And in Germany the Free Democrats always used to decide who was going to be the government - the Christian Democrats or the Social Democrats. What I mean is that under first past the post you have a good idea one party is going to be in government and one in opposition and vote accordingly. With PR you haven't got any idea who is going to join up with whom to form the government. Italy, similarly.
On 8 Sep 2018 at 8:08am Voter wrote:
The thread is about the constituency change and yes it will be a serious change for Lewes because larger areas of population such as Hailsham and Uckfield, where there is massive development, come into the new boundaries. The folk who live on and north of the Ashdown Forest (where?) have little interest in Lewes or the South Downs. But the original plan was for Lewes to merge with west Brighton, Whitehawk and Moulescome until it was pointed out there was no road that linked these areas without crossing into another constituency. The new coastal constituency will run from Kemp Town to Polegate and encompass a very elderly population with huge problems with road and rail. This leaves the Tories with a problem with the 2 current MPs and which will be selected for where.
On 8 Sep 2018 at 5:15pm MG wrote:
@bored: you make a fundamental mistake about this country's electoral system. We do not vote for a party, we vote for an individual. I am no LibDem but I used to vote for Norman Baker becasue he was a great constituency MP. PR is the worst form of democracy. No-one knows for whom they are voting, and all the power goes into the hands of the party machine. We already have PR, in the elections to the European Parliament, and hardly anyone knows or cares who was elected to that. It's a very large part of the sense the the EU is undemocratic that contributed greatly to the alienation that led to the Brexit vote.
The best form is the alternative vote that was rejected in a referendum, largely because many people seem not to have understood the process, but simply found out what Nick Clegg wanted, and voted against that.
On 8 Sep 2018 at 8:34pm Fairmeadow wrote:
I believe one of our Euro MPs is Nigel Farage. Surely that fact on its own is enough to convince everyone that proportional representation, or any other system where you vote for a party rather than a candidate, is a really bad idea?
I used to vote in Pembrokeshire, where one AM under the proportional representation system is the truly ghastly Neil Hamilton. No one would ever have voted for him, but if you allow parties to nominate candidates bound to succeed, he is the sort of slime ball they choose, and there is nothing voters can do about it.
On 13 Oct 2018 at 11:57am andrew wrote:
If they have majority then they should be elected ..thats all
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