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AV Experiment

On 4 Apr 2011 at 1:17pm Paul Newman wrote:
Who wants to participate in an electoral experiment - The election is for best food .Please vote for your favourites (only out of the candidates below ) in order of preference , I `ll start the ball rolling
Chicken Vindaloo-4th
Nice Salad From Bill`s with olives and stuff -6th
Kebab- 2nd
Venison stuffed with foie Gras with all trimmings -3rd
Fish and Chips -5th
Sussex reared Pork with Sussex apple sauce and cider- 1st

Arrange in order from one to six and we`ll see how simple this AV thing is
On 4 Apr 2011 at 2:53pm Deelite wrote:
1 - Sussex reared Pork with Sussex apple sauce and cider
2 - Kebab
3 - Venison stuffed with foie Gras with all trimmings
4 - Chicken Vindaloo
5 - Fish and Chips
6 - Nice Salad From Bill`s with olives and stuff
On 4 Apr 2011 at 3:06pm Tee hee hee wrote:
1-Sussex reared Pork with Sussex apple sauce and cider
2 - Kebab
3 - Venison stuffed with foie Gras with all trimmings
4 - Chicken Vindaloo
5 - Fish and Chips
6 - Nice Salad From Bill`s with olives and stuff
On 4 Apr 2011 at 3:09pm Bill's FTL wrote:
1 - Sussex reared Pork with Sussex apple sauce and cider
2 - Fish and Chips
3 - Kebab
4 - Chicken Vindaloo
5 - Venison stuffed with foie Gras with all trimmings
6 - Nice Salad From Bill`s with olives and stuff
On 4 Apr 2011 at 3:13pm Hoist wrote:
Ha - I get it! I don't want to eat bambi and daffy even if this is what we end up with
1- Sussex reared Pork with Sussex apple sauce and cider
2 - Nice Salad From Bill`s with olives and stuff
3 - Fish and Chips
4 - Kebab
5 - Chicken Vindaloo
6 - Venison stuffed with foie Gras with all trimmings
But having the Torys in again would be worse.
On 4 Apr 2011 at 3:25pm Paul Newman wrote:
So far we might as well keep First past the post , same result .
On 4 Apr 2011 at 3:29pm Ed Can Do wrote:
But so far the winning result has garnered 100% of the popular vote. Your ability to manipulate statistics for political gain is apparently as poor as your grasp of grammar.
On 4 Apr 2011 at 5:02pm MC wrote:
Less than 1% of Lewes residents voted so so the result is that something most people didn't want to eat is force fed to all. Vegetarians also have no choice but to eat meat.

I'd prefer a smorgasbord so that most people could find something they liked.
I'm also sure if people thought that there could be something they liked on the table they'd take more of an interest in trying to get it there in the first place.
On 4 Apr 2011 at 6:19pm Independent thinker wrote:
Interesting experiment Mr Newman. So let's look at this another way. You're organising your office Christmas party for 10 people and the pub gives you 3 choices, Beef, Turkey or Salmon, but everyone has to choose the same thing. So you ask around and find 4 want beef, but won't eat Turkey, and 3 want Turkey but won't eat Beef, and 3 want Salmon but won't eat Turkey or Beef. But the 7 Turkey and Beef lovers also like Salmon. So you're in charge, which meal do you pick if you want a successful party? Do you use FPTP and pick beef, thus ruining the party for 6 out of 10 of your staff? Or use AV to pick Salmon and allow everyone to enjoy themselves?
On 4 Apr 2011 at 8:47pm 'ere be monsters wrote:
That's why there should be a box for "NONE OF THE ABOVE" as previously discussed on other threads. Point made as both sides have just agreed.
On 4 Apr 2011 at 8:55pm Jonathan Spencer wrote:
This is all very well but not reality in your office situation everyone has a reason to vote, but what do you do 4 or 5 out of the 10 don't bother to vote at all because they don't like anything, or cant be bothered. I will go for political reform, but AV is only a small step, there is more to be done. The argument you are having about AV is interesting but as I said before AV is really a sop and a distraction, partly to us as an electorate when politicians have been so corrupt and partly in the battle for power within the coalition.
Tell me:
If those 5 out of 10 for the office party didn't vote because they wanted to go to the cinema, how do you engage them in the meal. Or because they can't come that night, or for a million other reasons. AV doesn't answer any of these, what it really does is try to legitimise a system, that we some might be critical of.
What about write ins, (where you can write in the name of a candidate) or fines for not turning up, or rewards for turning up like 10% reduction in council tax?
On 4 Apr 2011 at 10:21pm Paul Newman wrote:
Ha ..suppose ten beefs hate turkey, eight turkeys loathe beef and two hazelnut foams and a peanut drizzle have no real view but heard something 'anti nut' about beef once.Others don`t bother at all -Turkey wins by virtue of anonymity as decided by don`t cares whose qualification for deciding is a nutty predilection shared by no-one we would be wise to ignore . It does not have an overall majority and its legitimacy is contested by aggrieved Beefs so the Party ends in a brawl
On 4 Apr 2011 at 10:40pm Bella Donna wrote:
Norman Baker is a limp salad
On 4 Apr 2011 at 10:42pm Independent thinker wrote:
Jonathan Spencer, of course if there was PR they wouldn't all have to have the same meal, but the choice at the moment is between AV and FPTP so might as well stick to debating those two choices for now. Other options will have to wait for future referendums, unfortunately.

Paul Newman, read your last message three times but still no closer to figuring out what you're on about. I take it you're admitting defeat on this one? Or are you still going to try to argue that forcing the majority to accept something they don't want and voted against is what democracy is all about?
On 4 Apr 2011 at 10:53pm Jonathan Spencer wrote:
must say independent Thinker, your posts are often the better thought out and more persuasive ones
On 4 Apr 2011 at 11:25pm Eeek! wrote:
The sample size is far too low to be meaningful. Also Mr Newman does not understand how AV works. He should not have asked people t list choices 1-6. With AV you are not obliged to list all of the candidates. If you just want to put your 1st & 2nd choice or even just your first, that's fine.
On 5 Apr 2011 at 6:35am Paul; Newman wrote:
Dear dear Independent Thinker , furrowed brow already I thought it was simple ? That is precisely how AV works in real life and if you are stuck then don`t hide behind childish truculence . That example might be Conservative , Labour two Greens and a BNP constituency ( for example ) It is far from clear what 'you' are on about , sandwich -wise as no-one would be eliminated but I used a little common sense and grasped what point you were trying to make.Keep up or go away.
Eeek - Yes I do , further information is available at these links

Check it out here »
On 5 Apr 2011 at 6:47am Paul; Newman wrote:
Incidentally am I the only person to have noticed that in ITs example he has not explained how either of those on three is eliminated in round one ? It does not work in its own terms.I just moved on a with a sigh but should I ?
This is exactly what I fear, that some inchoate desire for change will land us with the system no-one wants and the only people that have it ( Australians) want to get rid of it , as did its only other developed example in Canada.
On 5 Apr 2011 at 8:05am 'ere be monsters wrote:
Has anybody actually changed their point of view after one of these "Lewes Forum" political debates?
On 5 Apr 2011 at 10:54am Hoist wrote:
Apparently not - it is just a forum for people to spout their own views and then disappear when these views are questioned. As in many of newmania's posts and the Libya stream below.
On 5 Apr 2011 at 10:59am Paul Newman wrote:
Niggle niggle Hoist , I do have things to do ya` know and I have been defending my views . You are the worst offender for ex cathedra pronouncements to the grateful multitude
On 5 Apr 2011 at 11:04am Hoist wrote:
Am not.
Going out now so can't toy with you right now anyway.
On 5 Apr 2011 at 11:14am Paul Newman wrote:
Typical woman
On 5 Apr 2011 at 12:13pm jrsussex wrote:
Have tried to start a new post, the system will not let me. This is in answer to the other thread on AV.
Richard R - "why do your realtives (from Oz) oppose compulsory voting?". Could be simply that they live in a democracy and hold that view. Other than that I have no idea.
Mrs Miggins - Yes i was, very much so. Posters from last year will remember me revealing that I was once, as a younger man, a far left-wing shop steward with the London Co-Op transport department, which was a closed shop in those days. I took the Daily Star (or was it the Daily Worker) every day. If my memory serves me correctly the discussion was with MC or Clifford, possibly both. I recall being enthralled one afternoon by a speech delivered by the great orator Michael Foot.
On 5 Apr 2011 at 12:58pm 'ere be monsters wrote:
I remember the "great orator" Michael Foot as Labour leader having his picture taken walking his dog on Hampstead Heath (or wherever) wild hair grubby looking raincoat waving his walking stick looking like a complete nutter. Funny how they lost that election.
On 5 Apr 2011 at 2:12pm Clifford wrote:
Yes, I remember jrsussex saying he had been on the left in the past. Even though I often disagree with what he says he does know what he is talking about and has the ability to construct a logical argument - unlike quite a few other posters.

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