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Should bonfire be with or without crowds? Part 2

 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 12:54am Me wrote:
No crowds would mean total freedom to do what we want and when on the night. If the crowds are there then we will give them a show our way at their cost. Either way we all have a freedom of choice either to watch or not or celebrate or not . A choice that was not available to those in the 16th century and before. Lest We Forget
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 7:49am Sherlock wrote:
And what is it you want to do and when on the night? Having a few drinks and throwing fireworks doesn't sound all that radical to me.
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 8:21am Prick Stein wrote:
We want to blow up fools like you! But seriously if you have to ask then your not going to understand the answer!
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 9:30am Dr Mouse wrote:
Do the majority of people attending or even taking part do so to remember the martys or the Gunpowder plot...? I think not .
When ever I come across a bunch of 'bonfire boys' i.e.lads in stripey jumpers in their teens and 20's they are chucking bangers about with no concern for nearby children and are generally totally Pi*ssed and using foul language....they don't give a monkey's about the history behind bonfire
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 11:02am Smiler wrote:
Its the same for the vast majority with bonfire and with Christmas, Easter, Halloween, St Patricks day, St Valentines day etc. etc. etc.
So why get so stewed up about it?
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 11:09am Sherlock wrote:
Prick Stein wrote: 'But seriously if you have to ask then your not going to understand the answer!'
The usual reply people give when they can't answer a question but are ashamed to admit it.
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 11:32am Dr Mouse wrote:
Who says I'm stewed up about it??
I just find that there is a lot of hypocritical codswallop written on here about bonfire tradition when 90% of people see it as a good excuse for yobbish behaviour/drinking/ etc...call me a snob or whatever ..it's just my view
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 11:34am The God of Hell Fire wrote:
Dr Mouse, even though I am sure that most of the people taking part DO remember the Matyrs and the Gunpowder Plot, there are millions of people around the world that celebrate Christmas, but how many of them do it because of the history behind it. No, for most of them it is not a religious occasion, but an excuse to drink too much and have a few days off work - with a few presents thrown in ! I can't hear any calls to ban Christmas though. As for WHENEVER you see any Bonfire Boys they are pissed up, using foul language, and chucking bangers at children ? Is that true ? I don't really think so. If the thousands who take part behaved the way you say they do then the fifth would be total chaos, which it isn't. There probably is a minority that behave like that, as you would find in any group of people that huge, but it is frowned on by the societies who generally police themselves very well.
And Sherlock, whilst there is a lot more to it than having a few drinks and letting off fireworks, what is actually the problem with that ? People around the world celebrate events with fireworks (gunpowder being particularly relevant in this case), and there are not many celebrations that do not involve the drinking of alcohol (even churches do that !) It may not be radical, but then who said it had to be ?
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 11:55am Me wrote:
I 2nd The Above Comments
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 12:07pm ere be monsters wrote:
Sherlock. So what would you suggest was a good 5th?
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 12:29pm Sherlock wrote:
The God of Hell Fire wrote: 'And Sherlock, whilst there is a lot more to it than having a few drinks and letting off fireworks, what is actually the problem with that ?'
My question was what did Me mean when he said there would be total freedom to do what he wanted if there were no crowds. I still don't know as he won't tell us.
'ere be monsters wrote: 'Sherlock. So what would you suggest was a good 5th?'
Seems fine as it is to me - apart from being over-policed by coppers you never see all year.
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 1:01pm Dr Mouse wrote:
Ok Mr God of Hell Fire, answer the following questions without consulting the web:
Who was the ringleader of the Gunpowder plot?
Which King did they intend to blow up?
Who ordered Westminster to be searched?
Where did the majority of the plotters escape to initially?
Name at least 2 of the Lewes martyrs
What year did Lewes first celebrate bonfire?
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 1:43pm Bonfirek wrote:
Ok smartie pants,here we go:
1. James 1st
2. Robert Cecil
3. Holbeach House, Kingswinford, Staffordshire
4. Richard Woodman, James Morris
5. At least as far back as 1670
So put that in your pipe and smoke it!
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 1:43pm Bonfirek wrote:
5. should actually read 1679 not 1670!
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 2:14pm Dr Mouse wrote:
1. Robery Cateby was the ringleader!! I bet if you ask 100 people on bonfire night, 99% would say Guy Fawkes
2. James I
3. Earl of Salisbury
4. Richard Woodman; G. Stephens, W. Mainard,
Alex. Hosman, and Thomasin Wood, servants; Margery Morris, and James
Morris, her son; Dennis Burges, Ashdon's wife, and Grove's wife, plus 7 others (i admit to needing to look these up)
5. This is debatable I guess

 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 2:20pm Dr Mouse wrote:
Forgot the escape question....it was the Midlands
After failing to rally the Catholic gentry of the Midlands to join them in a rebellion they reached Holbeach House in Staffordshire.
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 3:11pm me (again the real one) wrote:
STOP USING MY NAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 3:19pm ME wrote:
Try and think of something more original then....
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 3:21pm The God of Hell Fire wrote:
Very good Dr. Mouse, although I have actually read quite a few books on the subject (and seen the musical !) am not claiming to be a walking encyclopedia ! I think you would be surprised however just how many people would know that it was Robert Catesby. You are right about the Midlands, they went to a place called Dunchurch. It was at Holbeach House that they were finally caught.
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 3:42pm Dr Mouse wrote:
Ok fair enough...have a good 5th whether you enjoy the fireworks or stay in and watch the tele....
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 4:20pm me wrote:
Re . . Question number 5 above . . An Act of Parliament was passed on January 21st 1606 (3 James I, cap 1), to appoint 5th November in each year as a day of thanksgiving for 'the joyful day of deliverance'. This was by bell ringing, bonfires and etc.
Several references can be found in an old Lewes Churchwardens account book referring to payments made to bell ringers on the 5th November from at least 1661, A particular interesting entry dated 5th November 1723 states Nov, ye 5th. Item: Pd. ye ringers being ye day of Deliverance from ye powder plot.
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 9:27pm Brixtonbelle wrote:
I personally think we should celebrate the attempt to blow up parliament, not the foiling of the plot. Is that a treasonous thought ?
 
 
On 21 Oct 2009 at 9:27pm Rocket Man wrote:
Glad you saw the musical, God of Hell Fire! Good, wunnit?
 
 
On 22 Oct 2009 at 4:42pm Bonfire Escape wrote:
Its the yobbo idiots who should be targeted. I have witnessed these yobs (mostly teenage smugglers) and I think they should have to pass an initiation test with the committees of the bonfire societies, to prove that they will respect the tradition and understand the true meaning and also to agree not to throw rookies willy nilly. I saw some idiot in the procession (as we were walking to the firesite) throw a rookie at a man with a toddler and he thought it was funny. What a complete twat. I also think that each society should have marshals who ACTUALLY report bad behaviour to the committee so these morons can have their memberships taken away.
 
 
On 23 Oct 2009 at 8:19am ere be monsters wrote:
Which society were you following?
 
 
On 23 Oct 2009 at 9:58am The God of Hell Fire wrote:
Certainly in the Cliffe, the committee do take action against these kind of people, whether it be on the fifth, at an outmeeting, on a coach or in anywhere that the Society is represented.
 
 
On 23 Oct 2009 at 3:16pm Bonfire Escape wrote:
Borough
 
 
On 24 Oct 2009 at 7:31am Chat Champion wrote:
Post of the week award - Bonfire Escape - well done that errh man(?)
 
 
On 24 Oct 2009 at 11:30am Me 2 wrote:
Where were you when you saw that Bonfire Escape
 
 
On 25 Oct 2009 at 12:41am Borough Boy wrote:
Come with us this year bonfire escape and I'll ram a rookie down your fat mouth, you cowardly lying c.unt.
 
 
On 25 Oct 2009 at 1:02am cliffe girl wrote:
Oh Dear poor Borough boy has had too much to drink, he thinks he is passionate about 'bonfire' like so many deluded society members. I have been in the Cliffe for 35 years and have worked my arse off, fundraising and being a 'worker' . The majority of members of any Lewes Society want a safe and happy night, there will always be idiots within a society, which we will try to expel. Borough boy is an embarrasment who thinks he is being a 'die hard' bonfire boy ......no no no .
 
 
On 25 Oct 2009 at 1:45am Rod wrote:
It might be worth remembering that the origins of bonfire were riotous and that yobbish behaviour is not a new phenomena and certainly not exclusive to bonfire either. That said, all the societies have a (usually undersized) team of marshalls who work very hard during the night. Bonfire Escape, do you have any idea how difficult it is to report the bad behaviour of an individual when they are dressed the same as everybody else, the committee is busy here there and everywhere whilst fetching and handing out in the region of 200 torches in 10 minutes. In my teenage years I have also experienced friends of mine been being physically attacted for behaviour that was nothing to do with them; not an especially nice experience for a 15 year who just wants to have an enjoyable evening.
 
 
On 25 Oct 2009 at 2:10am Me 2 wrote:
At the end of the day . . . The public are welcome but not invited . . . But if its true what you say then the offender would be quickly ousted out of the society . . I for one would only consider dropping drops on hanger ons that try to walk with us that do not belong to bonfire . . . ie brighton students etc
 
 
On 26 Oct 2009 at 1:44pm Sussex wrote:
Seems to me that Borough seems to be a very unfair target in Lewes Bonfire. For a start they are the smallest Society, they have only a very small hand full of teenagers. Everyone knows everyone!! So therefore if there is any trouble it can be dealt with my an Officer or Committee Member of that Society (which it is).....not an interfering no body from the Cliffe who seem to think they are bigger and better than everyone and can dicate to the other Societies!! borough do not fight between themselves..........the Members who did that have left!! It is not without saying that every Society has the odd one or two Members that are are pain in the butt, its just unfortunate that the Borough has an Officer who has been a press target for the last few years, but it is not fair to bring down the whole Society. Please bare in mind that the Borough is one of the oldest Lewes Socieites and should be respected for that. The Society in Lewes with the biggest amount of young teenage trouble makers who have fights in out-meeting pubs every year and who attract the largest amount of trouble makers is Waterloo!!! so think again Cliffe Girl and Bonfire Escape!!! I would hardly say the Cliffe have a good health and safety record with dropped fireworks or fireworks in general you only have to look at injuries on the Cliffes fire-field over the years!! So get off your high horses.....if you want bonfire in Lewes to survive all the Socieites should be supporting each other....not pulling one in particular to bits! And yes the town does need the support of the general public to raise funds on the night......its the largest Society or Socieities who have loads of money that don't want the public!
 
 
On 26 Oct 2009 at 3:42pm lepper!!! wrote:
cliffe girl your society used to be as welcome as this credit crunch at out meetings or had you forgotten your passed!!!!! i could look in to the ambulance records and find out how many drunk or blown up cliffe members have been delt with!!!! looks like we had one or two over enthusiastic members!!!! did the borough put a nail in to the head of a member of the public??? (waterloo) or a woman in a coma from a seagull ??(cliffe) and bonfire boy im going to give you a lesson in conducting your self when dealing with people who's excrement boes not smell (or so they think).......
have a Safe and dry 5th...
 
 
On 26 Oct 2009 at 8:56pm Cliffe Girl wrote:
My response was to the POST that Borough Boy as an individual left,not to the society he belongs to, it was unnessarily aggressive. READ IT AGAIN !! I have a shed load of friends in the Borough and every other society. I never once mentioned how 'fab' the Cliffe are, in fact I feel the Cliffe are the weakest they have ever been at the moment. I don't think bonfire escape said anything that warranted being called a fat, lying c**t.!! Is that all Borough boy could come up with ? What a complete mug. It's idiots like him that will eventually screw up Bonfire for every society..........."ram a rookie down your throat....?" .......... Burk.
 
 
On 27 Oct 2009 at 4:02pm Pikelet wrote:
What Cliffe Girl said.
 
 
On 27 Oct 2009 at 8:42pm Sussex wrote:
I very much doupt that the so called Borough Boy is actually a member of the Borough........in fact I would go as far as saying that he isnt. My guess is that its an ex member with a problem, as I can not see a true member swearing on a public website in black and white!!!!! and i was refering to the attitude of the Cliffe in general (the Man Utd of bonfire) and a certain member of the Cliffe who came into the ranks at Nevill and tried to dictate and order around another societies members!!! How can you say the Cliffe are weak with 1200 Members and two plots of land.......try working with 150 Members and no shed!!!!! have a good 5th
 
 
On 27 Oct 2009 at 8:49pm lepper!!!! wrote:
what SUSSEX said!!!!! plus stay down your own end of town!!!!!
have a safe and explosive 5th!!
or glory.....
 
 
On 29 Oct 2009 at 7:55am Annette Curtin-Twitcher wrote:
Sussex, would that Cliffe member have been one of the Cliffe members who are asked to help marshal at Nevill year after year?
 
 
On 1 Nov 2009 at 2:59pm mr happy wrote:
My daughter of 10 was asked to do a talk about bonfire tomorrow morning. My family are in the Cliffe bonfire but my daughter doesnt go in it so has no costume. I put out a plea on facebook for a costume and a torch for my daughter to borrow. I had 4 replies all from teenage boys in Waterloo offering their jumpers and to get her a torch and anything else that may be usefull. It made me think about the threads that I had read on here over the last week and just want to say that some of these youngsters are actually lovely! Thankyou Waterloo I shall be watching you this year !


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