On Thu 28 Apr at 9:56am Nevillman wrote:
Can't believe he has no comment to make on any of the recent threads or even an attempt to subvert one of them to whatever crazy idea is in his head. Unfortunately I think he fell for the anti Vax conspiracy and unlike hypocrites like trump probably didn't have a jab and I know he is not a young man and there is a lot of covid around. Please confirm you're still there Tom.
On Thu 28 Apr at 7:18pm Green Sleeves wrote:
He is awaiting further instructions from the Kremlin.
On Thu 28 Apr at 11:18pm Tom Pain wrote:
Co vid - together seeing. Still looking out of my own eyes Nev. Uncrazed, untouched by the Gene Jab Genie or the Gremlin. Saw some goldfinches the other day, digging the garden.
On Fri 29 Apr at 9:48am Nevillman wrote:
Thanks Tom. Good to hear from you. Get a jab though. Effects of covid vary but can be very nasty still. Probably things pretty tough for goldfinches at the moment. Need some rain.
On Fri 29 Apr at 5:46pm Green Sleeves wrote:
Tom Pain is proper woke.
On Fri 29 Apr at 7:00pm Nevillman wrote:
There's principled stands, orders from the lizard people and stupidity. Not sure which it is for you Tom but I sincerely hope you don't catch it. It Really is not pleasant Tom and the jab helps. A 5g bot coursing through my blood system courtesy of Bill gates is a small price to pay to avoid serious illness or worse.
On Fri 29 Apr at 11:47pm Tom Pain wrote:
How kind of you to be concerned about my health. I think you should worry about everyone because we are soon to be faced with severe food shortages. Whilst the political elite don't need to concern themselves about such mundane matters, most of the world does. Sanctions on Russia are limiting the availability of fertilizer to farmers all over the world at this crucial farming time- spring. Nutrition is the key to health and food shortages are going to impact it in a far more serious way than a nasty flu. Stupidity, lizards and principled stands may be your choice but they're certainly not mine and as you're so keen on advising, I'll return the favour and suggest you make growing some food in your garden a priority. You're going to need it and it'll be much more use than the gene jab genie that shoots for the moon.
On Sat 30 Apr at 5:09pm Nevillman wrote:
I hope and think you are being unnecessary alarmist Tom. There will be some shortages in specific products from time to time I suspect and the price of food will undoubtedly rise. As food expenditure as a percentage of income has never been this low, for it to rise a bit won't have a hugely significant effect on most people. Apologies to people already struggling but most people aren't and will be able to absorb it. It might mean a cruise round the Mediterranean rather than the Caribbean for some people or going out to eat a bit less or a camping holiday and cancelling the sky subscription for a while. Hopefully the people who really are struggling to make ends meet will get more assistance from the government. People in the third world where food is already a far higher proportion of income will also suffer disproportionately more.
Basically Tom, you and I and the majority of people in this area don't need to dig up the rose garden just yet.
Incidentally, I never did find out what your objection to the covid jabs was. Please can you tell me. I had covid recently and was very glad that the jabs were helping me to feel less bad than I actually did feel. It hits everyone differently but if it is bad it is very bad. Really not just a cold.
On Sun 1 May at 9:17pm Tom Pain wrote:
How do you know that the jabs made you feel less bad? The fact that you got it and I didn't answers your question. It's impossible to answer mine.
On Sun 1 May at 10:10pm Green Sleeves wrote:
It felt far worse contracting covid than having any of the three jabs side-effects. I'm more confident now that if i were to get it again, it would be milder due to the 3 jabs, plus the original infection (although that was quite some time ago now). I don't feel like my DNA has been altered....
Anyways, why you so desperate to get sanctions on Russia lifted? Do you want their invasion to be more or less successful?
On Mon 2 May at 10:32am Nevillman wrote:
All the medical evidence seems to me to suggest that I got it less severely due to the effect of the jabs. Medical comparisons of covid sufferers who have and haven't had the vaccinations seems to me to be sound evidence of this.
As for getting it Tom I will only say that until I got it I was certain that I wouldn't until I did. Be very careful who you mix with Tom. I am still interested to know why you don't have the jab. Please can you tell me. No reason Tom but I am curious.
On Mon 2 May at 7:24pm Mark wrote:
Oh we all know Tom, Nev... He just enjoys going against the grain. You could tell that white is white and he'd argue all night that white is purple.
On Tue 3 May at 9:40pm Tom Pain wrote:
I've tried to reply twice now and nanny won't let me
On Wed 4 May at 9:04pm Tom Pain wrote:
Look at the last UKHSA figures to see why I'm not looking for a jibjab. They've stopped releasing figures "by vax status" because.....
On Thu 5 May at 12:24pm Green Sleeves wrote:
Nothing on the UKHSA site makes me think i've made some sort of grave error by getting vaccinated.
We get it, you are anti-vax, as it must be some sort of underhand conspiracy for controlling the population.....same with many of the other vaccines governments pressured its citizens to take up. You're an anti-vaxxer, and all those autism diagnoses have vindicated your tribe. If only we could all be as well-informed as you, TP.
On Thu 5 May at 9:15pm Tom Pain wrote:
No you obviously don't get it. You're too closed minded and reactionary to get anything with your safe pair of middle class hands firmly over your eyes and ears. Why are you so full of hate?
On Thu 5 May at 11:09pm Green Sleeves wrote:
I had 3 "jib-jabs" and no ill side-effects, I'm not full of any hate or emotion on this subject. I just don't see vaccines in a negative light, and am fully behind using them as they have proved over the decades to help humans fight diseases. I don't see why you are still so upset by them, given you have avoided them, and there are no restrictions anymore as far as i'm aware towards those who are unvaccinated. Whats your problem? You took a decision/gamble to not have it, and i took the decision/gamble to have it. We both seem to be still alive and comfortable with our decisions, and its not impinging on your civil liberties anymore, so whats the fuss?
On Thu 5 May at 11:49pm Tom Pain wrote:
You're making the fuss with your autism and antivaxer ravings. Do i go on about you being an anti pure blooder? Have I ever told you not to vax? No. Let's go through a few details uh oh its the witching hour over and out
On Fri 6 May at 10:05am Tom Pain wrote:
As I was saying- to recap the nuflu and its jibjab-
The complaint has a 99.58% survival rate.
The jibjabs do not prevent infection.
They do not prevent transmission.
They are experimental with no long term testing.
The manufacturers are legally protected from being sued if they kill you.
The "government" is legally obliged to follow instructions from the totally unelected WHO if they announce a "pandemic" of any disease whatsoever, no matter how innocuous.
The WHO is advised by Ferguson who has a track record of stupendously ludicrous, exaggerated predictions of disaster.
The WHO itself predicted that it's lockdowns would kill many more than the disease in poorer nations.
Let's have another one eh?
On Fri 6 May at 12:12pm Green Sleeves wrote:
Same tired lies and conspiracies. You learn nothing what anyone tells you unless its somehow confirming your wild conspiracies. Millions left dead and ur still none the wiser. Amazing ignorance.
I accept that the vaccines dont eliminate transmission or infection, but they almost certainly reduce it, and they absolutely help our immune system with reducing the more damaging affects of covid if you do get it.
Yes, small percentages matter, just like minorities in general. A vaccine to protect thousands of people dying from covid is totally worth it...as that is the reality of your survival rate stat. A small percentage suffer and died from covid, and in subsequent waves the only ones dying and/or hospitalised disproportionately were unvaccinated folks. Its really not hard to grasp. How many billions recieved vaccines in the past year or so? The population hasnt been secretly culled by this menacing vaccine, but the evidence to show its efficacy is significant. Perhaps you will have the last laugh as all us vaccinated grow a 3rd eyeball, but i think you may be once again on the wrong side of history. You're used to it by now, surely.
On Fri 6 May at 7:20pm Tom Pain wrote:
Oh dear, a slight bot glitch, half green and half red fred from the shed gor blimey.
On Sat 7 May at 10:23am Green Sleeves wrote:
You got picked up again by the forum filter? Its caught me out a couple of times, hence why i try to copy (ctrl-C) my posts before i submit, if the post is long enough. Then i edit accordingly to ensure it goes through if its initially "rejected".
I don't think you're being picked on for this, you just have to word your posts/responses like a lawyer. Imagine your posts keep getting an "OBJECTION!!", and occasionally the forum judge will say "objection sustained", which just gives you the opportunity to re-word your comments.
I think i may have been watching the Depp vs Heard case a bit too much lately....
On Sat 7 May at 6:18pm Tom Pain wrote:
Sleevie Wonder, what lies, what conspiracy? No filter problem just amused at your initial confusion of posting identity.
On Sat 7 May at 7:48pm Green Sleeves wrote:
Anti-vax stuff pretty much sums it all up. Plenty of lies and conspiracies in there, and generally downplaying a pandemic thats killed millions. There is almost certainly more room for a conspiracy theory to be real however with covid, than say on climate change....as the general consensus over man made climate change is virtually 100% of scientists. At least with covid, its newish and mistakes were bound to me made, which then can be used to totally undermine the entire thing. The several million dead, and the efficacy of the vaccines shown time and time again in studies, suggests to me its legit. My point being, that if you think man made climate change is a hoax, despite the overwhelming evidence and support to the contrary, then covid would definitely bring out your cynicism.
Its also worth sanity checking your own thoughts and beliefs sometimes.....for example, is there a common theme on the kinds of people you find sharing your views with? I must admit, if i found myself agreeing with David Icke and Qanon on a regular basis, i'd probably seek professional help....
On Sun 8 May at 9:57pm Tom Pain wrote:
You've said all that before, just say what I've lied about, don't be coy.
On Mon 9 May at 11:43pm Tom Pain wrote:
If I even knew about quanon I'd probably call myself sleevie wonder and post on this forum. But hey nev, don't you think that's typical denier tactics- calling someone a liar and then avoiding an explanation. Of course he never answers questions, just obfuscates, just like a typical antihealther.
On Tue 10 May at 9:03am Nevillman wrote:
You've been accused of repeating lies Tom. If you think that means you have been accused of lying that is you putting an incorrect interpretation on it. You also seem to resistant to the idea that what you believe in are conspiracies. I accept that you have not used the word conspiracy but it is implicit in your stated views. You believe that the 99% of climate scientists who have proved that the current heating of the planet is caused by human action are in some kind of conspiracy for their own purposes.
Similarly you seem to believe that a conspiracy of people destroyed the twin towers for their own nefarious ends and invented the story of the terrorists. Why did the tower collapse? Well our limited experience of planes being flown into tower blocks would suggest that in 100% of cases it does.
As for typical denier tactics Tom, you seem pretty well versed in those. Noone accused you of lying but stating it allows you to make that the issue.
All of the "conspiracy theories" that I accused you of holding, you have argued for on this forum. You haven't called them conspiracy theories but that is what they are. I occasionally pick you up on various points for my own amusement. Looks like green does the same but we both know that it is utterly futile. You don't follow any of the conventions of proper discussion. Your most recent post is a classic for its mixture of being victimised, false accusations, insults against others and avoiding any discussion of the points made.
You have succeeded in turning the whole forum into a forum for discussing you and your ridiculous points Tom. Your tactic of bombarding every thread with your own irrelevant points based on conspiracy theories has succeeded in deterring all the other posters thinking they were having a proper discussion. They realise it is impossible with you. The only sad ones left are you, me and green.
Anyway, don't let me deter you Tom. Wasn't it a great achievement putting men on the moon Tom.
On Tue 10 May at 9:05am Green Sleeves wrote:
Chill out, I don't think you are a liar, merely someone who believes in BS and feels comfortable spreading such BS as gospel. I don't think you are intentionally wicked, just a bit of a dumb-dumb who falls easily for rubbish. Same way I don't regard Jehovahs Witnesses as liars.
On Tue 10 May at 9:21am Green Sleeves wrote:
@nev - i think TP may be referring to buildings in Manhattan that were not directly hit on 9/11 by aircraft. "Building 5" - which i must admit thought it was "Building 7 WTC", famously came down some hours later after the twin towers collapsed and many were confused as to why or how it came down as it only suffered from fires from debris rather than a direct hit.
I remember being curious about it myself, and more so when I kept reading some of the former occupants of WTC Building 7. It became a popular conspiracy theory quite quickly that it was some sort of cover-up, and inside that building had all the big secrets and plans that the world was not meant to discover, so the building had to be "removed".....while it sounds very exciting, no one can be sure, and investigators have debunked any demolition explosive theory as no sounds were detected before it collapsed, leading to the much larger probability that the intense fires just weakened the structure throughout the day.
Not heard TP dismiss the moon landings yet....but I would not be shocked to the core if he started demanding why the american flag wavered in that iconic Apollo 11 footage....and "WHAT ABOUT THE SHADOWWWWSSS"!
On Tue 10 May at 6:26pm Tom Pain wrote:
You wanted me back nev, self inflicted again. Sleevie,the amusing thing about building7 was Jane "psychic" Stanley of the BBC. Have you looked at the moon landing vehicle recently? and the moon buggy- I wouldn't cart that to the beach, let alone half way across the galaxy. The thing that worries me is global norming, the moon's a balloon.
On Tue 10 May at 7:16pm Green Sleeves wrote:
Yes, it was curious that she made that announcement while it was still standing in the background!!
I'm gonna give this 9/11 conspiracy theory a pass though. It was a pretty chaotic day (to put it mildly!), so I suspect all sorts of information was bombarding journalists and a lot of misinformation and crossed wires happened. Seems that this fact-checker would agree. A reporting error from Reuters apparently. Given that the building was on fire for nearly 7 hours by that time, there could well have been rumours about its imminent collapse doing the rounds. No explosions were reported as mentioned earlier to signify a controlled demolition.
I've not given the moon-landing conspiracy theories much thought over the past decade or so. Sure I watched something years back which raised eyebrows....but on balance, I think the moon landing was legit!
Check it out here »
On Wed 11 May at 10:57am Nevillman wrote:
Always very happy to hear from you Tom although I do prefer it to be in the correct thread as this improves overall discussion or did in the days when that happened. Can't pretend to be very surprised about your scepticism of the moon buggy. I'm assuming you are sceptical about man landing on the moon at all. Correct? This would give you the full set.
Apparently people who believe in conspiracy theories are usually good at seeing patterns like faces in the clouds. In other words illusionary patterns. They are also like likely to be educated in critical thinking skills although they might be intelligent. They do however have an inflated sense of their own intelligence which allied with their lack of critical thinking skills and tendency to see patterns where none exists makes belief in a conspiracy more likely. Believing in a conspiracy and feeling part of a restricted community of fellow believers can help you to feel special and alleviate your feelings of anxiety and lack of control.
There you are Tom. I don't expect you to believe any of it applies to you and maybe it doesn't. THEY would say that wouldn't they.
On Wed 11 May at 9:52pm Tom Pain wrote:
I think you ought to do some critical editing! And I'm not talking about your twaddle. Read it again and take your foot out of your rather sanctimonious, supercilious mouth. Believe me nev, I'm trying to help you get over the trauma and insecurity brought on by self imposed restricted isolation over the past two years. Hint- critical thinking does not come from Wikipedia, fact checkers, newspapers or the TV. Try it sometime, the truth can set you free.
On Wed 11 May at 10:39pm Green Sleeves wrote:
Who cares? Nev made a typo, yawn, big deal. You don't need more than 3 braincells to work out what it meant to say, and it describes you perfectly TP.
On Thu 12 May at 9:12am Nevillman wrote:
I seem to have hit a bit of a nerve there Tom. I try not to get too upset about the odd typo as long as the meaning is clear to anyone who can be bothered to try to understand what is being said. I'm certainly not adopting a morally superior tone to you or anyone. I was repeating an article about why some people believe in what I would classify as conspiracy theories but which I'm sure you would classify as the unvarnished truth for those with the critical thinking skills to see it.
Thank you for your help in trying to get me through the trauma of the last 2 years. While at times your constant interruption of sensible threads with irrelevant, often confused and wrong points has irritated me, you are at the moment providing me with much amusement.
I constantly try to improve my critical thinking skills and will take on board your points. I actually never follow the news in papers or any media which is why I seldom comment on topical matters. I fact check from a variety of sources but I doubt if they are the same sources that you use. Which particular sources would you recommend?
On Mon 16 May at 11:32am Nevillman wrote:
Come back Tom. None of it is meant personally and you know I really do like you in real life. I am interested to know what your sources of information are if you feel like sharing it.