On Tue 30 Jul at 5:35pm Buzzard wrote:
Just in case you thought Brexit was about stopping immigration...
True, Polish plumbers and fruit pickers from Bulgaria may not be able to come here. Nor refugees fleeing from war zones. No, the government want to encourage "highly skilled" immigrants. Of course, what they mean is highly paid. Or indeed, rich. Priti Patel recently talked about "brilliant scientists", but it's more likely that what we'll actually get will be management consultants, marketing executives, financial analysts, tax (evasion) constulants, corporate lawyers, fund managers, and people who just get richer by being already rich.
And they'll buy first homes and second homes and city flats and country estates, and invest in buy-to-let, pushing up house prices so there's even less chance that local young people will be able to find a home.
And if you can't live here, you won't be able to move to Europe because, well, no freedom of movement. It cuts both ways.
Which will put a lot of ordinary Brits just where the international rich right-wing clique behind Brexit want them to be. Pathetically grateful for a bit of casual work picking fruit...
On Tue 30 Jul at 5:45pm Hyena wrote:
No one under £30,000, so no nurses then.
On Wed 31 Jul at 11:58am Basil wrote:
'And if you can't live here, you won't be able to move to Europe because, well, no freedom of movement.'
It's very strange, but I remember people moving to Europe to work and study or just enjoy their retirement before we joined the EEC in 1973. I remember overseas students here, people from Europe working here. You Remainers really do scrape the barrel of lies, don't you?
On Wed 31 Jul at 1:10pm Nevillman wrote:
Nonsense basil. Some people may have been allowed to live, work and study in some European countries prior to us and them joining the EU but to suggest that there was anything like the freedom of movement we currently have is wrong. You have no idea what any future arrangement will allow and to suggest that this is just scaremongering discredits you and your argument. You are scraping the barrel.
On Wed 31 Jul at 1:35pm Hyena wrote:
Basil Faulty, We send the EU 350 Million a week, not a lie?
On Wed 31 Jul at 3:17pm David Stanley wrote:
Free trade ultimately leads to open borders. Even the no-growth greens are internationalists . Voters just can't compete with the owners of "our politicians" .
On Wed 31 Jul at 3:37pm Hello wrote:
It was easy to go to Europe and get work long before the EU existed. I know this because I did it in the late 60's at the drop of a hat. Worked in 3 different countries in the end. Travel was easy as well - all you had to do was show a passport on entry. Perhaps that's too much effort for some to imagine
On Wed 31 Jul at 7:06pm Hyena wrote:
Hello, out of interest what work we’re you doing?
On Wed 31 Jul at 10:48pm Tom Pain wrote:
I don't think that Brexit was about stopping immigration at all,just hoping to keep it at a manageable level so that immigrants can assimilate gradually into our way of life. As a sovereign nation we have a faint chance of freeing ourselves from being corporate drones. The bigger the state gets the smaller the individual.
On Thu 1 Aug at 4:08pm Buzzard wrote:
Dream on, Tom. As little England (especially when the rest of the "awesome foursome" have detached themselves in disgust) we'll be far too small to defend ourselves against corporates and superpowers. The whole point of Brexit is to make us a powerless US sidekick and tax haven for the international far right kleptocracy.
On Thu 1 Aug at 5:31pm Nevillman wrote:
Disagree totally Tom. Within the EU we have far more effective legislation protecting the rights of employees and consumers. There is also stronger competition law restricting big business. When we leave we will not have this. We will also be forced into a ttip type trade agreement with the US which will be capitalism unconstrained. Please either refute my points or explain your point more clearly.
On Thu 1 Aug at 10:28pm Tom Pain wrote:
I think the City is an international tax haven already for the international left/right kleptocracy. Money has no politics or nationality. European Central Bank rules say no country can create it's own money and I'm sure that in the EU we'd have to join the euro very soon. Being that 97% of all money is created as loans at interest from your international kleptocrats ,cash is just the remaining 3%, the slim chance of escaping the debt slavery would be illegal under ECB rules. That's why I support Brexit, I know we have the same situation here but it's not illegal, though almost impossible,to try to get out of it. The main stumbling block is that hardly anyone knows about it and most don't want to.
On Fri 2 Aug at 8:39am Nevillman wrote:
I notice that you have not responded to my point Tom. I generally try to understand other respondents viewpoint when I respond but am really struggling with yours. Please will you try to explain it again. I must correct you on one thing. The EU cannot force us to join the euro. They can only do that if we leave and reapply to join. A situation which makes leaving all the more stupid.
On Fri 2 Aug at 11:03pm Tom Pain wrote:
I was also replying to buzzard. I think we would have to join the euro eventually,no matter what they say. Look at the impossible conditions they set for leaving. It's just like the hotel California "you can check out any time you want but you can never leave". I don't believe anything any politicians say,,, almost. Whoever holds the purse strings holds the power and politicians don't. It's as simple as that- banks withhold credit, money dries up and there's no trade,then there's a depression. We have a fiat currency based on nothing except fiat, which is I say so, nothing more. The UK is bankrupt, officially,look it up. So big business is restricted in the EU, it doesn't look like it to me,in fact while I've been posting it's just got a little bigger. You believe and I don't,end of.
On Sat 3 Aug at 4:25pm Basil wrote:
Nevillman wrote: 'Within the EU we have far more effective legislation protecting the rights of employees and consumers'.
Do you really believe that Nevillman or is it just something you parrot? What do you think of Macron's Thatcherite labour 'reforms', pushed through by decree? Is that an example of EU protection? Do you know how bad the conditions have been for German workers and claimants since 'reforms' a decade ago? Why do you think youth unemployment is still so high in many EU states if the purpose is to protect workers? The only thing that protects and improves workers' rights is a strong trade union movement.
On Sun 4 Aug at 2:58pm Nevillman wrote:
Much employment protection legislation does drive from the UK and may be due to the unions but much derives from the EU eg working time, parental leave, rights for part timers etc. That France can introduce its own laws only makes a lie of the leave argument that the EU is a strait jacket. What I've seen of Germany does not suggest that the workers are having a bad time. Please explain.
Quite frankly, being accused of parroting views by a leave supporter comes over as pretty rich basil. I'm disappointed that I have to do the research into EU employment legislation for you. I am making a list of the stupid reasons given for why I am about to get a lot poorer and this will make the list.
On Sun 4 Aug at 9:07pm Tom Pain wrote:
If we leave remainders will blame everything on the leavers. If we remain the leavers will blame everything on the remainders. Get the serfs blaming eachother for their situation while the rulers who caused it in the first place have a good laugh over their brandy and cigars. Classic divide and rule technique, it's always worked and on the evidence in this forum,it always will.
On Mon 5 Aug at 8:49am Nevillman wrote:
Suddenly starting to realise how manipulated you've been Tom?
On Mon 5 Aug at 12:09pm Tom Pain wrote:
If suddenly is measured in geological time about 30 years is the blink of an eye and in that case you're quite right. I'm an old fossil now. After the referendum I said on the forum we'd be shafted whatever the result and my opinion hasn't changed. In fact I probably said the same thing as my above post about the blame game as well.